Excellent across and down clues. We laughed out loud at the “or” puns. (This is my first comment ever.)
@Ward F Fine first comment!
How did the mansplainer die? He died in a WELL, actually...
@ALH I think, actually, if you’ll permit me to just set you right there, i mean i don’t mean to butt in, but i think the punchline should be … “and police are looking into it “
Should I just tell you my comment, or sing it to you, loudly? CONVEYORBELT?
Ken Jennings should have been given credit for that answer. It wasn't wrong!
@Steve L He was definitely NOT wrong, it just wasn't the answer that Jeopardy would accept. They should've given him the money for a correct answer, because it was their mistake for not thinking of it.
@Steve L I don’t think a “hoe” is immoral though ?
@Steve L Interesting (and I'm sure argued to death by now) but while homophones for sure, isn't "hoe" wrong because the morally questionable person is a "ho"?
@Steve L IIRC he was retroactively given credit for the answer but I could be wrong
@Steve L It was wrong. A 'ho' is not seeking pleasure; rather, money. An immoral pleasure seeker in that context would be the 'john'.
@Steve L This whole thread has me thinking of Velvet Jones.
@Steve L No, it was wrong because "ho" and "hoe" are different words
I haven't seen a Goto statement in code in a long time, thankfully. Some great clueing in this one!
@David Johnson You, too? I used to sprinkle those guys in my FORTRAN code like it was salt on popcorn.
@David Johnson Over four decades for me.
@David Johnson *23456 500 CONTINUE
@David Johnson "GOTO is considered harmful" since 1968. Thank Edsger Dijkstra for that guidance. Ik not even sure about switch statements to be honest ;)
@David Johnson Return Linefeed Rubout Rubout.
@David Johnson This clue/answer took me back to my days of writing BASIC code (later QuickBasic) and getting great results, albeit with plenty of spaghetti. IF...THEN...ELSE GOTO (variable name, which was a step up from old BASIC line numbers). Once, when programming with a friend/co-worker, we were stuck on a good variable name for the next subroutine so we just called it VARR (which is like naming your dog "Dog"). The memories are so pleasant that I thought for a moment I'd look and see if there were any free BASIC compilers out there I could tinker with for fun, but of course there is no task imaginable for which a new, nifty bit of code in an ancient language would be handy. I am obsolete. Not the first time that thought has arisen.
I got a nice kick out of that! A very nice kick, indeed! And not one in the European bum. I wasn't super-fast at figuring out what was going on with the theme answers, but the puzzle gave me a nice shot of those cool brain chemicals you get when something falls into place. I am a HUGE fan of [Blue stop sign?] Just excellent wordplay. 11D was funny in a bizarre way, which is often my favorite way. Very nice done, Mr. Kugelman.
@Francis Yup, that was a bit naughty, but nice, eh? 😉
This was, for me, like the start of a rollercoaster ride, where the car inches up the tall hill, straining and squealing, building anticipation, then comes that precious moment of zen at the top where the world stands still, followed by the bam-bam-bam rush of nonstop thrill. So it went for me, filling in the box around the edges and getting some crosses in the theme answers but unable to crack them, working deliciously hard, until that wait-a-minute moment where the answer started coming, then it did, and immediately after, bam-bam-bam, all the other theme answers fell, and in the blink of an eye and a wow, the puzzle was done, and there I was sitting with a goofy smile, thinking, “What just happened?” That’s a good puzzle. Not to mention an appearance by the lovely-to-see three-S ROSSSEA, some sweet answers in SENSATE, SIDLED, TERTIARY, SLOE-EYED, and POISON PEN, and a clever, original, and tight theme. An entertaining day-brightener you made, John. Thank you and bravo!
@Lewis OK, hands up, everyone who immediately thought of Sondheim's lyric: "First, you're another sloe-eyed vamp, Then someone's mother, Then you're camp! Then you career from career to career." From the truly great song, "I'm Still Here."
I got a kick out of the theme, especially TENOR TWENTY. Very clever. Thanks, John. A good start to the day. [Lady of the estate] MANOR WOMAN
@Anita Sorry, didn't see your post before posting a similar one.
So first, let me be clear, I thoroughly enjoyed this puzzle on a lot of levels. A great theme which was laugh out loud and clear as crystal. Wonderful, interesting accessory fill like SLOEEYED, OHNOREASON, MENAGERIE and SAFEWORD (used fairly recently I think, but probably well after John submitted this, and with a fun fresh clue). Also a lot of clever clues elsewhere. Still I’m curious if people will agree with me that this is more a Wednesday theme instead of Thursday. And I felt for me it solved like a Wednesday too. This could be one of those days where I really was on the constructor’s wavelength—I got both OWL and WING right away despite the misdirection, and just spent the day in Clam Pass Beach in Naples where I watched a clam SIDLE past me, so got that without crosses; and anyone my age who watched “The Beverly Hillbillies” would probably fill in TEXASTEA as soon as the X in NIX fell. Still this was a 12 minute solve for me. I don’t usually mention my times and this is not a brag; I am not a speed solver and this is an unusually fast time for me for a Thursday or even a Wednesday, so wondering if others had as many gimmes as I did, or if it’s just me today. Still, bottom line, I always enjoy a John Kugelman puzzle (despite his being your sworn nemesis, Andrzej) and today was no exception, so forgive my musings about the challenge because that shouldn’t take away from the overall achievement of a great puzzle, theme and grid.
@SP Excuse me, I was in Clam Pass but of course it was a Crab which SIDLED past me; haven’t seen any sidling clams lately.
@SP Perhaps Captain Q will weigh in on clams sidling.
@SP This being Kugelman effluence, my heart was not in it and I knew virtually none of the multiple trivia entries, but it solved like a Tuesday/Wednesday, anyway.
@SP I perked up when I saw John Kugelman's name up top, but I couldn't agree more. Nice puzzle/wrong day. I did have to check a cross to see whether we were dealing with batS or OWLS, but most of the fill was very straightforward.
@SP Agreed; almost exactly my Wednesday average.
@SP Agreed. I enjoyed it but I hope for something tricksier on a Thursday.
A disappointment. Everything so easy, and subpar answers such as "main" and "oh no reason". As to the latter, what the devil? It's just a terrible clue and answer set, unless I'm missing something clever. "Written with venom" sure seems like the wrong tense, and while overarm seems awkward and alien to me (as it did the columnist) perhaps it's more common in sportsball circles. The theme was paper thin. Latest in a long recent trend of uninteresting Thursdays. :(
@B Won’t comment on the rest which are fair reactions whether I agree completely or not; but “poison pen” Is an adjectival phrase, as is “written with venom”. I agree you wouldn’t necessarily interchange them in a sentence, but I think they are grammatically equivalent and it’s a fair (but too easy?) clue
@B - it’s an OH NO reason for the kid 😆
@B I'm so with you on this! And I absolutely hated how random the answer of "oh no reason" was. Typical Kugelman 🤷🏽
@B Holy, let’s quit the tired usage of “sportsball”, it’s as clever and witty as you think this puzzle is
@B POISON PEN as a response to “written with venom” bothered me, too. I’ve always thought of the poison pen as the instrument, not the act. Although Merriam-Webster does define POISON-PEN as “written with malice or spite”. I guess it makes more sense if you insert a hyphen, although I don’t think I’ve ever seen it written that way.
@B I had no problem with OH NO REASON, which I thought was hilarious. But I agree that this was not a Thursday puzzle, not by a long shot. I came in expecting a tricky theme and was extremely disappointed.
@B OHNOREASON was a clever answer. Perhaps you missed the intended intonation? MAIN drag was also a clever misdirect, imo.
Lovely puzzle, a tad too easy, but not enough to complain about. Very amusing theme, and one that benefited from not having a revealer, (something I complain about sometimes). The themers were all excellent. And some excellent fill as well, with little that felt stale. I especially liked the clue "Blue stop sign?". Definitely worth a chuckle. And I gave myself a (virtual) pat on the pack for getting TERTIARY with just one cross. And some advice: If you're going to put your report card in the trash, put it way down deep in the trash. If it's just sitting on top,... My complaint? It's not a Thursday theme. You know it. I know it. We all know it. It's not a bad theme; it's a perfectly good theme. It's just not a Thursday theme.
@The X-Phile Yes, we agree again. Scary, in a way. ;-)
@The X-Phile It's not an old Thursday. It is the new and future Thursday, as long as subscriptions drive revenue.
39D [Comes on little cat feet] Then there's Carl Sandburg's famous poem. About Chicago. He called it a haiku. Fog By Carl Sandburg The fog comes on little cat feet. It sits looking over harbor and city on silent haunches and then moves on.
I cackled aloud at the Jeopardy clue. And then had to apologize to my cat. I sent myself astray thinking the instrument would be either lute or lyre, so I helpfully filled in the first and last letter. That got me stuck in that section until I deleted the l and the e...
This was a Thursday puzzle??? Felt like a Wednesday - maybe the NYT is also lagging this week after the 3-day weekend…
As always, I was not on this constructor's wavelength (I find his clues to be joyless stretches rather than clever misdirection), I didn't know the trivia (of which, as is usual with him, there was a slew), and I thought the theme was meh (at least the dad joke factor was slightly below Kugelman's average - the single, minor blessing today). Still, I completed the puzzle in Tuesday/Wednesday time 🤷🏽 Why does my least favorite constructor appear to have the most puzzles published by the NYT... And on Thursday, too, which is the day I wait for to be intelligently challenged by an inventive theme and smart clues 😢
@Andrzej Do you have a favorite constructor(s)?
@Andrzej As you can imagine, I'd also like to see less of this constructor.
@Andrzej Thank you for saying all that! I have the same feelings.
"Senseis"?? A sensei can be a teacher of anything, and is never pluralized with an "s".
@Beverly I get the sense that you might have also put "samurai?" Ha
@Beverly Once a word is borrowed, it becomes subject to many indignities.
@Beverly Welcome to the tamale trap. Make yourself at home and have a panini, and maybe play with some Legos. Sensei is never made plural with an S in Japanese. This is an English puzzle, however. <a href="https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/sensei" target="_blank">https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/sensei</a>
@Beverly What bothers me isn't the pluralization, but rather the inaccuracy of the clue. A SENSEI does not necessarily guard the bushido tradition, since as you mentioned a SENSEI can be anything from a teacher to a doctor to a manga artist--anyone who is more skilled than you. Additionally, someone who keeps the bushido tradition is not necessarily anyone's SENSEI, especially in this day and age, when being a samurai has gone somewhat out of fashion. I was so confounded by this that I assumed there must be some clever Thursday trick at hand. Alas, clever Thursday tricks seem to have gone the way of the samurai.
Unlike almost everyone commenting before, I enjoyed this puzzle and thought the theme phrases were clever and fun. Easy compared to my Thursday expectations, but it made me laugh a couple times and that made up for it. I didn't dislike the 'oh, no reason' entry as others apparently did. I don't know what was so objectionable - it's something I might have said when I was a kid (I wasn't a quick thinker.:-)
A dooking good theme. But rather gentle for a Thursday. Entrance form? DOORDIE A singer refuses? CANTORWONT
[Outfit for the highly motivated beau?] SUITOR TUXEDO
@Tom -- You're on the same wavelength as one of our cleverest commenters, Anita, five posts earlier...
Thank you, Lewis, for the very kind compliment. That means a lot coming from you, I admire and look forward to your comments every single day. Tom, regarding your response to my post, no worry about the duplicate. I’m happy to know we think alike.
42 is always a correct answer Country Home Critter = MANORMOUSE
Meh puzzle for a Thursday. Pretty much ruined by 40A.
@Curtis. Would the alternative clue, which has been seen in some form, “N.C. College” pass your approval?
@Curtis I'm sure the editors will see to it that no future puzzles include the name of someone you personally dislike. Thank you for your attention to this matter.
@Curtis Err... just get over it. Even you Dems own Teslas, and you flaunt them quite well.
Fun! I kept holding my breath, looking for a rebus, but it didn't appear, and when I solved MAYORMAYNOT, the cat was out of its proverbial bag, (or, the proverbial cat was out of its bag... or the prover... never mind.) and the rest fell into place. I don't hate the rebus puzzles, they are just more work, and I am lazy. Once I get their pattern, it's fine, it's the discovery that makes it "work." Today's puzzle, with a fun theme, and real wordplay, made my morning! I loved the challenge, and the feeling of a satisfying Thursday. Now I have time to go out and enjoy this gorgeous day.
@Marlene "I don't hate the rebus puzzles, they are just more work, and I am lazy." Love this.
I have to throw a penalty flag on OVERARM. I've heard of overhand, underhand, and sidearm, but never "overarm".
@Randi I think the penalty flag will be overturned when challenged.... Baseball isn't the only throwing sport, after all. I hadn't heard of it either, but I never assume that means it doesn't exist. 🦗🏏🦗🏏🦗🏏🦗🏏🦗🏏🦗🏏🦗🏏🦗🏏🦗🏏🦗🏏
@Randi I have never heard of overhand. You can throw OVERARM, sidearm or underarm.
@Randi Maybe stop to consider that your knowledge of the world is limited?
I'm planning on spending a night in Dodge, Kansas this fall. It amused me to no end to learn that Dodge is the Seat of Ford County. The military officers who lent their names to the town and county are unrelated to the respective car makers
@Steven M. It is actually called Dodge City.
Nice puzzle, Mr. Kugelman. Not a killer, but cleverly clued. The theme fills made me smile every time, and I'm trying to lighten up these days. Thank you!
Awesome Wednesday puzzle!
I was desperately wanting to get MANOR MUPPET to work
So many complainers! I thought this was a fun one, great wordplay.
@Liz H. fun? check great wordplay? check There were some complaints that it was a bad puzzle (disagree) but most of the complaints I read were that it wasn't tricky or difficult enough for a Thursday. That's on the editors, not the constructor.
I’d like to credit Stephen Colbert for my correctly guessing WACO — i knew it because on his last* show he mentioned that Waco has the largest Dr Pepper bottle in the world, and it’s what they really really want to be known for… *I really wanted to write “latest” PS ARSE still makes me wince — for a Brit it really seems much too rude for the Gray Lady!
@Petrol Same on WACO! I always looked forward to watching his monologue. As news happened, I would think "What will Stephen Colbert do with this?". 😢
@Petrol Agreed. Too much tat and loo humour at Times, but needs must, no? 🤔
Okay I definitely got a chuckle out of FACTORFICTION.
Wow I liked a lot about this puzzle even before I got into today’s Wordplay and really got the theme 100%! Love this theme <:) I had Casanova and then Loverboy before getting LOTHARIO lol. As well as the themers I also liked OH NO REASON for “Why’s your report card in the trash?” and the last three letters of 13 D “Oil, they say.”: I thought it was TEXAS Gold but finally got the A in TEA. Brilliant job, John Kugelman! I think that can’t have been easy to think of or execute. Great wordplay.
@Convoid-04 The Beverly Hillbillies theme song refers to oil as Texas tea.
@Convoid-04 My first guess was svengali :)
Wonderful, John Kugelman! Just goes to show you - a little knowledge CAN BE helpful... It was bound to happen - a grid would come around with all the right odds and sods to scratch an (almost) esoteric itch! Pure TEXASGOLD!
I liked the theme clues and answers - clever and fun and useful in the solve. Just one thing that nagged me: OH NO REASON. Phrases like this (i.e. not actual phrases, just a string of words sometimes seen together) seem almost cheating to me, but I understand it in American grids with so much open space needing "inventive" fill. But, the clues for these need to be really tight, otherwise it's just frustrating since there's no way to guess the answer without lots of crossers. At that point you may as well not have a clue at all. The clue for this one was not tight: it genuinely didn't help me get the answer, I just noticed what the string of words was in the end. Apart from that, a great puzzle. It was satisfying to finally win the battle with the NE corner, despite the best efforts of bygone baseball players and teams and San Francisco streets and, oh, no other reason... Thanks John!
@Alex OH, NO REASON is an "actual" phrase, at least in my corner of the USA. It's a cute/evasive response to a probing "why" question---more or less like the question in the clue.
@Alex 100% agree on OHNOREASON. Just a completely arbitrary phrase that has a tenuous connection to the clue. It creates artificial difficulty.
@Alex it’s funny, I like the little surprises like this that come out of solving the other answers. Makes me chuckle. Like the blue stop sign. (Pineapple)
@Alex - Agree. I certainly don't need each clue to be solveable by itself if the crosses can lend a hand (it is called a crossword after all), but I too am missing the connection between the clue and the answer. I was expecting some sort of pun with a letter grade reference... something like "IDONTCIT" that would connect the idea of bad grades.
ARSE/PARSE, SENSATE/SENSEIS were nice echos for me of the theme wordplay. ARSE, HOE, SAFEWORD gave me a little buzz, which 42A squelched. Even I finished a little early for a Thursday, but CMON: if you think a puzzle is massively too easy “for its day,” maybe wow us with your brilliance in your comment instead of just going AARGH?
A cute wordplay theme, nicely clued. Though I can't remember exactly what puzzles he's created, I have this feeling that John Kugelman comes up with one fresh and imaginative idea after the other. FACTOR FICTION alone, with its wry clue, is worth the price of admission. I've always called the pitch OVERHAND, even though I always call the other one SIDEARM. Very inconsistent of me. But when I couldn't fit OVERHAND into the spot meant for OVERARM, I instantly suspected a rebus. (I hadn't figured out the actual theme at that point.) Re 16A: What on earth was Ken Jennings talking about???????? I also don't get SAFE WORD. Is it that the word itself isn't "blue", but the activity that it's "stopping" is? A pretty convoluted clue, John. But mostly I liked the wordplay in this puzzle and had fun trying to figure out the answers out in advance.
@Nancy Among some consenting adults whose sexual practices include BDSM, a safe word is a sort of code meaning “Stop. Really stop.”
Looking forward to the irate responses which will be generated by the misogynistic secondary cluing of the long-handled garden tool. Another wonderless and straightforward Kugelman confection for me.
@Matt Ken Jennings famously and incorrectly, as the clue indicates, asked "What is a hoe?" instead of "What is a rake?" when that club was provided on Jeopardy!
@Matt Maybe, but it was an hysterical mistake and I got a huge kick out of it.
@Steven M. Yes. But his inadvertent laugher had nothing to do with Kugelman's incendiary formulation here.
@Matt It bothered me that it was used at all. It's time we got rid of the incorrect, sexist notion that a certain kind of worker is *seeking* pleasure. That pronunciation is also problematic, while we're at it. Also not a fan of ANAL, and I can't believe no one has complained about the inclusion of a certain controversial billionaire's name. Then there are the random phrases that mar so many puzzles these days. Lots of problems and far too easy for a Thursday. Finished it fast just to get it over with.
@Matt Only from people with no senses of humor. It was funny then, and it’s funny now.
Loved it! I don’t care if it’s a Wednesday or Thursday ease puzzle. It was a great theme, and some great tricky questions. Can someone please dumb down for me “oh no reason”? ? Thanks.
@Alexia I just read it as an innocent lie from a kid …
@Alexia It's a form of "I'm not sayin' " and is intended to bypass scrutiny or explanation. As I mention above, this line is best delivered in a light, higher-pitched voice, possibly while moving to distract/change the subject. It's an art. (Not! LOL)
@Alexia I tried to interpret it as someone saying, "Oh, no!" after seeing a report card in the trash but gave up. It's clunky.
Good long workout for me, but a really cute theme. It was fun working out each of the theme answers. Two thumbs up for this one. And of course - a puzzle find. A Thursday from August 13, 2015 by Jim Hilger. There were four blank squares in the puzzle and those were the theme. Some examples: SHORTL_UNCH (LUNCH break) JA_IL (JAIL break) Some other theme answers: SPR_INGVACATION COMMER_CIAL HEA_RT STA_TION Here's that link: <a href="https://www.xwordinfo.com/Crossword?date=8/13/2015&h=58a" target="_blank">https://www.xwordinfo.com/Crossword?date=8/13/2015&h=58a</a> ....
@Rich in Atlanta And one more puzzle. A Thursday from May 5, 1994 by Mel Taub. Theme clues and answers: "Hollywood palmist?" READERHAYWORTH "Hollywood quack?" CHARLATANHESTON "Hollywood's leading undertaker?" LIONELBURYMORE Here's that link: <a href="https://www.xwordinfo.com/Crossword?date=5/5/1994&h=57a" target="_blank">https://www.xwordinfo.com/Crossword?date=5/5/1994&h=57a</a> And I'm done. ....
All the little chicks with the crimson lips Go Cleveland rocks, Cleveland rocks! I'm actually headed to Dayton this weekend for a wedding. Looking forward to destroying some Skyline chili dogs.
@Grant Your post made it through! FWIW, I think more of the country calls them chili dogs than calls them coneys--just not in Michigan. (And personally, I find that coney chili kinda weird. Give me a good Skyline any day.) Did you click on my first YouTube link? I think you might enjoy it, viols aside.
@Grant That Ian Hunter album is pretty good, the one the Drew Carey song is from. Do you know it?
Well gosh I guess I have no complaints to contribute here. I thought it was a cute and fun Thursday, finished in a little over half my average. Enjoy the day.
@Mary You don’t have to complain to take part here, but it sure helps.
Today's poem made from words found in today’s puzzle<br> a/ walking of night by the whistling wire d/ radio comes in like a hole in the dark if you’re death say so with a little laugh a/ no reason not to
Did any other “Portlandia” fans try to fill in 32-Down with CACAO?
@Trey <a href="https://www.nytimes.com/shared/comment/4gdfv3?rsrc=cshare&smid=url-share" target="_blank">https://www.nytimes.com/shared/comment/4gdfv3?rsrc=cshare&smid=url-share</a>
Any puzzle with OMAR and NINA in it is okay by me. Because it's a Thursday puzzle i was wary most of the time solving, but enjoyed it despite no tricks. Thanks John.
What was this? Because, as enjoyable as it was to do, it wasn’t a Thursday puzzle.
@abelsey These complaints are getting tedious and making the comments section a drag
@abelsey I agree with you. And please continue to share your opinions.
Now, THAT is a puzzle! Very original. Once again I find that starting from the bottom paid off nicely--not that I didn't traipse down the garden path a time or two... For example, I STOMPed instead of TROMPing. Best of all, I remembered when TEXAS TEA was an unknown for me (maybe a couple of years back, actually.) Also, it's handy to know words like LOTHARIO, which don't get used all that often. Trickiest clue prize goes to 30A Kind of a drag? I've never heard of Jimmy CARR; is he a comic we'd like to find of Netflix, or one of those shock-'em types....? For "I'm so mean I make medicine sick," I wanted Don Rickles... but I guess his day is over.
@Mean Old Lady Jimmy Carr is a British comic. I think he is on Netflix but is also capable of bad taste jokes.
@Mean Old Lady I lived in Oklahoma for 30 years and never heard oil referred to there as Texas Tea. But it’s forever entrenched in my mind from The Beverly Hillbillies soundtrack.
@Mean Old Lady I grew up hearing that term on the Beverly Hillbillies but didn't know if it was "Tea" or just the letter "T."
The wordplay in the theme answers is a delight! I rushed through the puzz last night but now this morning on second look it is wonderful. Gotta stop rushing!
Thank you John Kugelman for a truly delightful puzzle. I can't say I saw the theme straight away, but when I did it brought me a big smile. Please keep them coming. I am sure my aging brain is benefitting from all the puzzles I do. Now I'm off to practice with my handbell choir, which is another thing that's good for my brain. Be well my friends.